Age/Comment Feature???

ckag

First of all, let me apologize if this is a duplicate message. I thought I posted my query last week but it never showed up in the forum so I'm trying again.

I am a long-time user of jv16 PT and to support the program, I even purchased 2 Platinum VIP licenses. One of the most important features of jv16PT, to me, has been the Age/Comment feature. I was very disappointed when it was dropped in 2010. When it was promised to return in 2011, I waited patiently.

Last week I installed 2011 (v2.0.0.1007). I may be missing something, but I couldn't find the old Age/Comment reature anywhere. I did see the Tags feature, but the functionality is totally different from the old Age/Comment feature.

1. In the old Age/Comment system, when the Software Uninstaller loaded, anything that wasn't specifically marked as Old was shown as New and stacked at the top, making the New items easy to find and comment. This is not the case in the new Tags feature. In the new Tags feature, one must actually Tag an item as Old or New which is not helpful at all in identfying new entries.

2. Under the old Age/Comment feature, one could add individual comments to a line. Under the new Tags system, one must create a Tag and add it to a list of Tags.

As mentioned above, the functionality of Tags is competely different from the old Age/Comment feature. Please tell me that the old Age/Comment feature still exists and if so, how to turn it on. In the meanwhile, I am once again reverting back to v1.9, the last version to have Age/Comment in it.

Please advise. Thanx!

redseujac

Age/Comment does not exist in this version.

engineer

ckag

I TOTALLY agree with you on the Age/Comment feature. It is the by far the greatest feature I use in the jv16 PowerTools! As such, I am still "stuck" using PowerTools 2009.

Seems amazing to me that such a great feature would have been dropped! It has FANTASTIC use when trying out new/unknown software. As is so often the case, the program's uninstall will fail to properly/fully remove various registry items. The Age/Comment feature makes easy the supervision of such things, and thus, the manual removal. This is on top of the very useful ability to track just what has been installed, when it was installed, and special notes on the install.

So, once again, I am still "stuck" using PowerTools 2009. I suppose promised features do not mean so much here ...

tullik

I use the Tag System to do what the old Age/Comment System did, and more. 8)

* Some examples:

02-21-2011_14-55-19.jpg

02-21-2011_14-49-06.jpg

02-21-2011_14-50-37.jpg

02-21-2011_14-51-45.jpg

02-21-2011_14-52-40.jpg

ckag

Engineer:

>> It is the by far the greatest feature I use in the jv16 PowerTools! <<

Agreed!.. The Age/Comment feature is what set jv16PT apart from all the other registry tools and why I chose it in the first place years ago before it was even Macecraft.

>> This is on top of the very useful ability to track just what has been installed <<

Yes, especially since many softwares also install 3rd party software as part of the installation. And invariably, they do not uninstall those 3rd party softwares along with a general uninstall.

ckag

Tulik:

The information cam be placed in the Tags but it's not as functional as beore. Let me try again on why I like the old Age/Comment system and why the new Tags system is of no use to me.

1. Under the old system, by default, if an installed program was not specifically marked as Old, it was automatically marked as New. When the Software Uninstaller is loaded, all of the New programs are stacked at the top of the list so you can easily see what has been added to the registry. This is especially useful when installing new software to see what has been added because oftentimes a major piece of software will also install 3rd party elements.

In the Tags system, one can add a Tag that is marked Old or New, but one needs to that manually. Also, the Old/New tags are really added as an aftertought after any other tag. It is MUCH harder to find New programs vs Old programs.

2. Rather than allowing individual comments as in the old system, one must now add a tag to a list of tags. As noted in your example, you must now scroll thru a large list to find anything. Practically speaking, this doesn't help at all. Once you've installed a program and commented it, it's probably not going to change unless you uninstall it. Hence, maintaining a list is useless to me.

I do see from your reply that you feel that the new Tags system offers more information, but from the standpoint of an old user, all of the major functionality has disappeared. Previously, it was so easy to see what had been added and then to quickly comment it and mark it as Old. You loaded the Uninstaller program and BAM, it was all there right in front of your eyes. The left column indiccated any NEW additions, and, of course, the right column would have no Comment in it. All of that functionality is now gone.

Again, the old Age/Comment feature is what set jv16PT apart from all the other registry tools out there. I sincerly hope that the Macecraft considers returning the functionality of Age/Comment. I could live with Tags as a way of commenting a line entry, but to be useful to me, I need the New/Old column and the associated sort on New/Old for quick and eay reference.

engineer

ckag;

I could not have said it better!

Thanks!

tullik

@ ckag

All the Age/Comment functionality you speak of is there in the Tag System. To use it, you have to think outside of the Age/Comment box, and modify your procedures to get the specific functionality you want.

I doubt that jv16 will ever add back "Age" and "Comment" columns because of limits of screen real estate, for one example (*). He might do something like automatically tagging untagged lines with "New" for certain tool lists. If he does that, it would possibly be an option in the Settings tool.

In the short term, to use Age/Comment functionality, I see these available choices:

Continue using PowerTools 2009 (your current position).

Learn to use the Tag System.

(*) Also, the old design was a bit of a kludge. I never reported on that, but a search of the archives might point to the complaints others had about its lack of consistency.

br1229

I agree that the age/comment feature should be added back to the program. It also seems to me that in an earlier post, this was said to be a priority for 2011.

Can't believe everything you read I suppose. :

tullik

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br1229

Perhaps you are right tullik, but I hope not and that he reconsiders.

tullik

br1229 wrote
Perhaps you are right tullik, but I hope not and that he reconsiders.

Perhaps. In the meantime, I'm learning to use the tag system, so I'm good whatever happens.

ckag

Tulik:

>> To use it, you have to think outside of the Age/Comment box, and modify your procedures to get the specific functionality you want. <<

I'm not inflexible, but I just don't see how I can modify my usage to make up for the shortcomings in Tags. As I said, the information is there, but the functionality has been lost. That said, what kind of modifications do you suggest? Without the sort, the only way to find new items is to manually scroll thru the whole page each time. Is this what you mean? If so, then yes, I can do that, but that's loss of functionality when the program used to do it for me automatically.

>> I doubt that jv16 will ever add back "Age" and "Comment" columns <<

I sort of expected that. No offense intended, but in this age of bloatware, everyone (not just Macecraft) is trying to add more bells and whistles to their programs but oftentimes at the expense of real functionality.

>> He might do something like automatically tagging untagged lines with "New" for certain tool lists. If he does that, it would possibly be an option in the Settings tool. <<

If screenspace is really an issue, then there is no need to have an Old/New tag as long as there is an optional sort available to put all untagged lines at the top of the list so that they are easily identifiable as new, untagged items. As for being optional, Age/Comment was an optional item in Settings. You could turn it on/off there.

>> Continue using PowerTools 2009 (your current position). <<

Yes, I know my options. Without the sort, the Tag system doesn't offer much to me. As I said, the Age/Comment system set jv16PT apart from other registry tools. If Macecraft adds a sort that automatically puts the untagged lines at the top of the heap in the Software Uninstaller, then I can work with it. Till then, I'll be using 2009. FWIW, I've already purchased "lifetime" licenses so I have no reason to buy other tools as long as 2009 works (seems to work okay in XP, Vista and Win7, and I run an even older version ins Win98SE) But in all honesty, I can no longer recommend this program to friends and colleagues.

I will continue to watch and download new versions to see if improvements (from my perspective) have been made to Tags, but until then I'll stick with 2009.

tullik

ckag wrote
Tulik:

>> To use it, you have to think outside of the Age/Comment box, and modify your procedures to get the specific functionality you want. <<

I'm not inflexible, but I just don't see how I can modify my usage to make up for the shortcomings in Tags. As I said, the information is there, but the functionality has been lost. That said, what kind of modifications do you suggest? Without the sort, the only way to find new items is to manually scroll thru the whole page each time. Is this what you mean? If so, then yes, I can do that, but that's loss of functionality when the program used to do it for me automatically.

Functionality:

Old/New
- * Old way: The first time you bring up a list with the Age System enabled, every line is "tagged" as "New." Since this is obvious nonsense, you select all and "tag" them as "Old."
  
  * New way: The first time you bring up a list with the Tag System enabled, every line is not tagged. Since you know they are all old with respect to the first time, you select all and tag them as "Old."
What's new in a list run later?
- * Old way: You click the "Age" column header a time or two so all the ones automatically marked "New" sort to the top.
  
  * New way: You click the "Tag" column header a time or two so all the untagged ones sort to the top. A blank tag = a line that was not tagged as "Old" previously.
Disclaimer:
- * Old/New does not make sense for every tool list which can have tags in the Tag System.
  
  * It does make sense for more tool lists than were supported by the Age System.
  
  * Tags can have purposes, user-defined, which go beyond "Age" and "Comment."

ckag wrote
>> I doubt that jv16 will ever add back "Age" and "Comment" columns <<

I sort of expected that. No offense intended, but in this age of bloatware, everyone (not just Macecraft) is trying to add more bells and whistles to their programs but oftentimes at the expense of real functionality.

It's my opinion that the current rendition of PowerTools is less bloated than prior ones, while remaining rich in features, with better usability characteristics.

ckag wrote
>> He might do something like automatically tagging untagged lines with "New" for certain tool lists. If he does that, it would possibly be an option in the Settings tool. << If screenspace is really an issue, then there is no need to have an Old/New tag as long as there is an optional sort available to put all untagged lines at the top of the list so that they are easily identifiable as new, untagged items (1). As for being optional, Age/Comment was an optional item in Settings. You could turn it on/off there. (2)

(1) Addressed above under "What's new in a list run later?".

(2) The Tag System can be turned on/off in Settings.

ckag wrote
>> Continue using PowerTools 2009 (your current position). <<

Yes, I know my options. Without the sort, the Tag system doesn't offer much to me. As I said, the Age/Comment system set jv16PT apart from other registry tools. If Macecraft adds a sort that automatically puts the untagged lines at the top of the heap in the Software Uninstaller (1), then I can work with it. Till then, I'll be using 2009. FWIW, I've already purchased "lifetime" licenses so I have no reason to buy other tools as long as 2009 works (seems to work okay in XP, Vista and Win7, and I run an even older version ins Win98SE) But in all honesty, I can no longer recommend this program to friends and colleagues.

(1) Addressed above under "What's new in a list run later?".

ckag wrote
I will continue to watch and download new versions to see if improvements (from my perspective) have been made to Tags, but until then I'll stick with 2009.

You earlier expressed some concerns about "Comments." If you restate them, maybe I will have some suggestions that address them.

ckag

Tulik:

>> New way: You click the "Tag" column header a time or two so all the untagged ones sort to the top. A blank tag = a line that was not tagged as "Old" previously. <<

Okay, now we're getting somewhere. You now indicate that there is indeed a way to sort on tagged/untagged. I looked at the handbook but didn't see that. I must've missed it. If I can click on the Tag column header and get a sort to put all the untagged lines at the top, then I can work with that. I'm tied up today so it may not be till tomorrow that I can reinstall 2011 and give it another try. I also agree that New/Old is superfluous as long as there is a sort to show untagged lines at the top.

>> The Tag System can be turned on/off in Settings. <<

I missed that too, then. Under which category/tab is it listed. That's no biggie since I want it on, but I should know where.

>> You earlier expressed some concerns about "Comments." If you restate them, maybe I will have some suggestions that address them. <<

Yes... I said that I preferred being able to write an individial comment rathe than having to scroll thru a long list of tags or adding to a list of existing tags. However, I also said that I could work with that aspect since commenting is not something that is done all the time.

The bottom line is that you have addressed my main concern which is a sort on tagged vs untagged lines. Since you say the sort is there, just not automatic, then I can work with that even if it's not as convenient as being automatic. I will reinstall 2011 at my earliest convenience and get back to you. Thanx!

redseujac

ckag wrote
>> The Tag System can be turned on/off in Settings. <<

I missed that too, then. Under which category/tab is it listed. That's no biggie since I want it on, but I should know where.

Home > Settings > Advanced Interface > List options > Allow tags to be added to lines.

redseujac

ckag wrote
>> New way: You click the "Tag" column header a time or two so all the untagged ones sort to the top. A blank tag = a line that was not tagged as "Old" previously. <<

I looked at the handbook but didn't see that. I must've missed it.

As far as I know it's not in the Handbook.

If I can click on the Tag column header and get a sort to put all the untagged lines at the top, then I can work with that.

In general it's always possible to do a sort when clicking on any column header. The "tag" column is not an exception to that rule.

tullik

ckag wrote
Tulik:

>> New way: You click the "Tag" column header a time or two so all the untagged ones sort to the top. A blank tag = a line that was not tagged as "Old" previously. <<

Okay, now we're getting somewhere. You now indicate that there is indeed a way to sort on tagged/untagged. I looked at the handbook but didn't see that. I must've missed it. If I can click on the Tag column header and get a sort to put all the untagged lines at the top, then I can work with that. I'm tied up today so it may not be till tomorrow that I can reinstall 2011 and give it another try. I also agree that New/Old is superfluous as long as there is a sort to show untagged lines at the top.

I haven't read the manual yet, but did place different tags on lines in a list, and then clicked the "Tag" column header.

ckag wrote
>> The Tag System can be turned on/off in Settings. <<

I missed that too, then. Under which category/tab is it listed. That's no biggie since I want it on, but I should know where.

It's in the "Advanced Interface" tab under "List options."

ckag wrote
>> You earlier expressed some concerns about "Comments." If you restate them, maybe I will have some suggestions that address them. <<

Yes... I said that I preferred being able to write an individial comment rathe than having to scroll thru a long list of tags or adding to a list of existing tags. However, I also said that I could work with that aspect since commenting is not something that is done all the time.

After you add tags and close the "Tag Editor," it arranges the list of tags into a collating sequence. You can also place more than one tag on a line.

You can use these features when you compose tags to make the tag list be in an order that best fits your needs. If you change your mind, you can rename a tag.

ckag wrote
The bottom line is that you have addressed my main concern which is a sort on tagged vs untagged lines. Since you say the sort is there, just not automatic, then I can work with that even if it's not as convenient as being automatic. I will reinstall 2011 at my earliest convenience and get back to you. Thanx!

Since the last done column sort is (supposed to be) remembered in a new session, it is "sort of" automatic if you don't resort any column after the first time you arrange a list.

ckag

Tulik:

Thanx for the previous tips. I have reinstalled 2011 and with the newfound knowledge that I can change the sort manually by clicking on the Tags column header, I can force the untagged items (which would be New items) to the top of the heap. Or rather, to the top of two lists since there are now 2 lists within the Software Uninstaller (with uninstaller and without uninstaller).

Now that I can easily identify the new items, I can also easily add tags to them.

For my particular purposes and uses, 2011 is still not as good as 2009 inre Tags vs Age/Comment, but at least it's workable now. It takes a few more keystrokes and a lot more scrolling thru the lists (both software and tags) to accomplish the same thing, but I can live with that.

Also, in going thru the manual once again, I did find where Tags could be enabled/disabled in Settings. I did not, however, see any mention of the all-important sort order being available by clicking on the column headers.

As an aside, I note that the Tags data seems to be stored in TagSystem.dat. If Age/Comment is totally dead, why is there still an AgeComment.dat file created after a fresh install?