Bug - incorrect sort

Discussion of jv16 PowerTools 2010. Note: this product version is no longer supported, feel free to use this product if you want but please remember that if you encounter any problem with it you should update to the latest version.
roberta
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Re: Bug - incorrect sort

Post by roberta »

bdh wrote:Hi all,

I don't comment often but I do feel I'd like some sort of feedback from Macecraft on the comments Applefitch (& Roberta - hi fellow Aussie!) have made above. I have a lifetime platinum licence so I'm quite comfortable about not having to fork out money for each major upgrade - that's not an issue for me. However, I think the comments about the 2010 version being abandoned in terms of bug-fixing should be considered by Macecraft. Whilst I can appreciate there is much effort going into the 2011 version, it is still a bit of a worry. How long have they been making Power Tools for? How many 'point' versions and major versions have been created? Surely one would think they would know this piece of software inside out, up and down and back to front by now. They should be able to jump on a bug and squash it almost as soon as it appears, shouldn't they?! Granted, I am not a talented software designer like Macecraft staff but it is quite disconcerting to read about the bugs in the 2010 version and not see immediate attention to it. All the while I'm using this software to safeguard/fix/finetune my machine - my most important and crucial business and personal tool! I would like to think that the software I'm using is as bug free as possible. I know JV maintains that there is no risk of the 'bugs' harming our machines but, c'mon, it has to leave most of us with an uneasy feeling knowing there's buggy software in our arsenal and nobody is intent on fixing it.

So, yes, while I have the highest respect for JV16 & friends and their ability to create this wonderful program in the first place, it is always unnerving to see it remain 'unpatched' for so many lengthy periods when bugs are frequently reported. I think more communication here is key - from Macecraft to it's loyal clients. If there is to be no regular fixing there should at the very least communication about why not - perception is everything. Negative perceptions have brought down bigger companies than macecraft before this. JV, are you there?
A VERY emphatic +1
Roberta
The Land Downunder
applefitch
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Re: Bug - incorrect sort

Post by applefitch »

bdh wrote:Hi all,

I don't comment often but I do feel I'd like some sort of feedback from Macecraft on the comments Applefitch (& Roberta - hi fellow Aussie!) have made above. I have a lifetime platinum licence so I'm quite comfortable about not having to fork out money for each major upgrade - that's not an issue for me. However, I think the comments about the 2010 version being abandoned in terms of bug-fixing should be considered by Macecraft. Whilst I can appreciate there is much effort going into the 2011 version, it is still a bit of a worry. How long have they been making Power Tools for? How many 'point' versions and major versions have been created? Surely one would think they would know this piece of software inside out, up and down and back to front by now. They should be able to jump on a bug and squash it almost as soon as it appears, shouldn't they?! Granted, I am not a talented software designer like Macecraft staff but it is quite disconcerting to read about the bugs in the 2010 version and not see immediate attention to it. All the while I'm using this software to safeguard/fix/finetune my machine - my most important and crucial business and personal tool! I would like to think that the software I'm using is as bug free as possible. I know JV maintains that there is no risk of the 'bugs' harming our machines but, c'mon, it has to leave most of us with an uneasy feeling knowing there's buggy software in our arsenal and nobody is intent on fixing it.

So, yes, while I have the highest respect for JV16 & friends and their ability to create this wonderful program in the first place, it is always unnerving to see it remain 'unpatched' for so many lengthy periods when bugs are frequently reported. I think more communication here is key - from Macecraft to it's loyal clients. If there is to be no regular fixing there should at the very least communication about why not - perception is everything. Negative perceptions have brought down bigger companies than macecraft before this. JV, are you there?
+1,2,3, and 4

Do you need a formal invitation to respond Jouni? Or is this another one of those uncomfortable issues that you so regularly ignore? It's not that difficult from our side of the aisle. Just explain to us paying customers why you decided to abandon the much touted, most spectacular jv16PT2010 after only 4 months since its release. We're all anxious to know the reasons why jv16PT2010 apparently is such an embarrasment to you. I could up the ante and recall some jv16 history that gives context to this all too familiar pattern, but I'll take the high road and give you the benefit of the doubt.

Note: Jouni is most certainly reading this thread. As such, I thought it would be helpful to provide a little encouragement.
applefitch
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Re: Bug - incorrect sort

Post by applefitch »

Still here and waiting for your reply Jouni.

Again, please explain to us jv16PT2010 users why you abandoned it after only 4 months? We are paying customers and at least deserve some kind of response. Your silence only furthers the suspicion that jv16PT2010 was never meant as a real release, only a stop-gap.

Finally, why should anyone trust jv16PT2011 or any future versions given the abysmal support for jv16PT2010?
tullik
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Re: Bug - incorrect sort

Post by tullik »

I extracted the PowerTools release history from the Macecraft site's news archive.

News Archive
Regarding the 6 1/2 month "life" of PowerTools 2010:
  • If you do a forum "Advanced Search" for keywords = delphi 2010 and author = jv16, and read the 42 posts found, you should be able to deduce why PowerTools 2010 took longer to release than Macecraft expected.
Regarding fix "abandonment:"
  • IMHO, such talk reflects more irritation than accuracy, and is certainly not very realistic.

    All eight of the PowerTools products can run on my x64 Windows 7 desktop PC. In every product, not every Macecraft bug was fixed. Also, new bugs (incompatabilities) have appeared as the software environment changed (e.g., Windows 98-->XP-->Vista-->Windows 7) and the hardware environment changed (e.g., x86-->x64).

    Has each PowerTools product improved compared to the prior one? On balance, yes.

    Will every PowerTools 2011 bug be fixed? Probably not. Here's a list of some current bugs: http://www.macecraft.com/phpBB3/viewtop ... =28&t=4335 Some will probably be fixed, but I don't expect all will be.
tullik -- Win 10 x64
applefitch
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Re: Bug - incorrect sort

Post by applefitch »

Yes, we're all painfully aware of why jv16PT2010 took forever to be released. We still don't know why it was abandoned only 4 months after its release.

Irritation? Most definitely!

Realistic? What industry standard releases "the best yet" version of its software only to trash-can it 4 months later? That's the issue here and the reasons for the abandonment continue to go unanswered. Nevertheless, from a lay perspective, it's easy to guess why Jouni abandoned jv16PT2010. It was and continues to be a financial albatross. But going down that road was entirely Jouni's decision, not ours, and he can't even follow through with that decision.

So when the rhetoric rolls out, as it did with jv16PT2010, that Macecraft will only put out the best product, no compromises, and will stand by those high standards even if that means delaying a release for months because Macecraft wanted to be sure that their customers did not receive a product that failed to meet their high standards, it rings very hollow when the product is abandoned 4 months later, bugs and all.

And what you've just described is precisely the reality behind the rhetoric -- Ahhhh, it's good enough. We're no different that any other software company. jv16PT2010 will always have bugs and it's unrealistic to fix them all even when we know about them in the current release, months before releasing the new version. Yeah, that doesn't sound as nice and certainly won't find its way to the main page. But it's the truth....

In any event, thank you tullik for taking the time to respond and provide some sort of defense of jv16PT2010. I don't think you made your case but at least you made the attempt. You certainly have more faith in the product and process than does Jouni. He can't even bring himself to respond let alone stand behind his own product, which is consistent with his treatment of jv16PT2010. And, by the way, Jouni's penchant for hiding his head in the sand when under criticism is also consistent with his past practices.
tullik
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Re: Bug - incorrect sort

Post by tullik »

applefitch wrote:Yes, we're all painfully aware of why jv16PT2010 took forever to be released. We still don't know why it was abandoned only 4 months after its release.
I posted the release announcements so others could do the date arithmetic more accurately.
Irritation? Most definitely!
Yes, indeed.
Realistic? What industry standard releases "the best yet" version of its software only to trash-can it 4 months later? That's the issue here and the reasons for the abandonment continue to go unanswered. Nevertheless, from a lay perspective, it's easy to guess why Jouni abandoned jv16PT2010. It was and continues to be a financial albatross. But going down that road was entirely Jouni's decision, not ours, and he can't even follow through with that decision.
It's not an industry standard. I call it hyperbolic marketing. I largely discount and ignore such stuff.

I have no information about the financial performance of Macecraft products.
So when the rhetoric rolls out, as it did with jv16PT2010, that Macecraft will only put out the best product, no compromises, and will stand by those high standards even if that means delaying a release for months because Macecraft wanted to be sure that their customers did not receive a product that failed to meet their high standards, it rings very hollow when the product is abandoned 4 months later, bugs and all.
Again, I call it hyperbolic marketing; I largely discount and ignore such stuff.
And what you've just described is precisely the reality behind the rhetoric -- Ahhhh, it's good enough. We're no different that any other software company. jv16PT2010 will always have bugs and it's unrealistic to fix them all even when we know about them in the current release, months before releasing the new version. Yeah, that doesn't sound as nice and certainly won't find its way to the main page. But it's the truth....
Yes, it is, and applies to every software company I know about. The truth also has other dimensions -- like decisions about impact, cost versus benefit, for example.

There's also the matter of a product's usefulness. That's mainly where I, as a user, focus my attention.
In any event, thank you tullik for taking the time to respond and provide some sort of defense of jv16PT2010. I don't think you made your case but at least you made the attempt. You certainly have more faith in the product and process than does Jouni. He can't even bring himself to respond let alone stand behind his own product, which is consistent with his treatment of jv16PT2010. And, by the way, Jouni's penchant for hiding his head in the sand when under criticism is also consistent with his past practices.
You are welcome, but I wasn't trying to defend anything, just stating my perception of fix realities.

I have no comment about your personal remarks about the developer.
tullik -- Win 10 x64
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